User:Pinecove

History

Back in November 2006 Pinecove joined the Zelda theorizing community. He joined in the time of the split wars where fierce battles raged between the linearists and splittists of ZU, however since Pinecove wasn't familiar with the split timeline he joined the linearists in the time of their conquest.

OoT/MM-TP-TWW/PH-ALttP-OoS/OoA/LA-TMC-FS/FSA-LoZ/AoL, was the timeline that Pinecove joined with. Eventually he became enlightened by the group who called themselves the UWM and came up with the timeline of:

OoT/MM-TP-TWW/PH-TMC-FS/FSA-ALttP/LA-OoS/OoA-LoZ/AoL. OoX was moved to after AoL at a later date but that's a different story...

Over the coarse of history, Pinecove became a well know theorist who at some points could get a little hot headed. However he was still well loved. The time came to pass when the split timeline was confimed. This devastated Pinecove and the entire theorizing community, however time moved on and Pinecove continued from where he was before exept with ALttP and the majority of the games in the child timeline.

Eventually the bombers were formed at ZU, and that struck the fall of the UWM. The iron fist that had ruled ZU for so long crumbled and the world was at peace...well not really. The fall of the UWM stopped theorizing from happening much. Pinecove along with a few other rebels still around in theorizing began to theorize again and ZU was saved..... sadly the people who started immigrating to ZU were noobs and Pinecove caught what theorists call "the sudden sickness", the desire to not theorize that much anymore struck Pinecove and he was not to be seen again for 8 months.......

When Pinecove returned to ZU, he was essentially a newb. All his friends from theorizing were gone and ontop of all of that he somehow had come up with the craptacular theory of

LoZ/AoL-OoT-TWW/PH LoZ/AoL-OoT/MM-TP-TMC-FS/FSA-OoS/OoA/LA-ALttP

Skylark, and Majoraman were quick to be on the scene and Pinecove was converted to the senario of

OoT/MM-TP OoT-WW/PH-LoZ/AoL-OoX-TMC-FS/FSA-ALttP/LA

He had never been certain of that timeline though, and since he had come back to ZU in the time of the "LoZ wars" his timeline was changed at least 3 times a month.

Over the coarse of the next 5 months in theorizing, Pinecove changed his views dramatically. He has no set timeline now, and simply tries to make theorizing a better place for others.

Personal views on points of Controversy

Mainstream games

Legend of Zelda

• Ganon wields the trident.
• People are living in caves because Ganon took over.

The Adventure of Link

• Legend of Zelda Hyrule, as stated in its manual, is a "little kingdom" in the Hyrule region. Adventure of Link Hyrule is the region, with Legend of Zelda Hyrule being the small southwest portion.
• Maze Island is the same place as the one from Phantom Hourglass.

A Link to the Past

• The GBA version, and the changes made in it, are more canon than the NOA SNES version.
• The lumberjacks are another form taken on by the Kokiri.
• Ganon split his soul, creating a "bunshin", in order to escape the Seal prior to A Link to the Past.
• Ganon's soul-split possessed Agahnim.
• Agahnim was an ideal target for Ganon, as he was an evil priest.
• When Agahnim died, Ganon's soul-split left his body and returned to Ganon.
• The Palace of the Four Sword is canon.
• The Dark world was completely obliterated by Ganon's own creations at the end of the game as shown from the palace of the four sword ending.

Link's Awakening

• The Wind Fish is a descendant of, and/or the same type of spiritual being as the Ocean King of Phantom Hourglass but has no relation to Jabu-Jabu from Ocarina of time, or Jabun from The Wind Waker.
• Marin didn't actually escape the dream at the end. Link simply sees seagulls and is reminded of her.

Ocarina of Time

• Sharp and Flat were Hylian.
• The Sheikah used Gossip stones to spy on the various races of Hyrule.
• Malon's mother was not a Gerudo.
• The Desert Colossus is not representing Din.
• Kaepora Gaebora is Rauru.
• During the seven years Link was asleep, Ganon killed the other five Ancient Sages.
• During the seven years Link was asleep, Ganon killed most of the Hylian Knights.
• Link was sent back to a time before he'd pulled the Master sword but after he met Zelda.
• The Ancient Sages, with the exception of Rauru, are no longer alive but have new incarnations, the Ocarina of Time sages.
• Link became the Hero's shade from Twilight Princess.
• The song of storms paradox can be explained by the multiple concepts of time.
• When Ganondorf gained control of the Sacred Realm covering it in darkness, he opened portals to the Sacred Realm in all the dungeons.
• Since the Sacred realm is covered in darkness, this was how Ganon covered Hyrule in darkness.
• When we beat said dungeons, we close the portals to the SR.
• At the end of Ocarina of Time the sages open the portal to the Sacred realm to seal Ganon.

Majora's Mask

• Termina is a parallel world to Hyrule.
• Skull Kid is the same one who you play Saria's Song for, and sell a mask to, in Ocarina of Time.
• The Giants are counterparts to Twilight Princess' Light Spirits.
• The inside of the Moon is a physical manifestation of Skull Kid's psyche.
• The Stone Tower was built as a defiance to the Goddesses of Hyrule, who the people associated with the despised Skull Kid.
• The Stone Tower was not flipped by divine intervention, and in all actuallity, there was no intervention by the Goddesses whatsoever.
• The Garos brought the Light Arrows with the intention of flipping the Stone Tower.
• Majora and Great diety are both evil spirits sealed in masks.
• The Skull kid and the happy mask salesman are counterparts to eachother.
• There was a great war in Ikana, between the Garo and the Icanians.
• Majora is the devil of Termina.

Oracle of Seasons/Ages

• The games can be played in either order without major effects to the storyling, but Seasons-Ages is the more canon order.
• The Master Sword is Canon but it isn't the same on from Twilight Princess etc.
• Onox and Veran are Twili.
• Jabu Jabu is a descendent of Ocarina of Time's Jabu Jabu, and/or Wind Waker's Jabun.
• The linked game and ending are canon.
• The Triforce either returns to the Sacred Realm at the end of the linked game or it remains in the castle.
• The time traveling in Oracle of ages can be explaned using the concept of multiple times.
• The yoshiro is Twinrova.

The Wind Waker

• Prior to Wind Waker, Ganon escaped the Sacred Realm Seal by breaking it.
• Ganon's escape of the Flood Seal can be explained by Ganon splitting his soul, using the bunshin to kill the two Sages who empower the Master Sword, putting the two parts of his soul back together, and being free to roam, as the Master Sword no longer had the power to seal him.
• The Kokiri, as spirits, did not techincally "evolve", but instead, took on a new form, and became the Koroks.
• Some of the Zoras evolved into Rito and some of them became "fierce Zoras".
• The rito are half Zora half human/hylian.
• The plan of the Deku Tree and the Koroks to create more land with their seeds works. The results are seen in Tingle's Rosy rupeeland.
• Ganon is completely dead at the end of The wind waker.
• The Tower of the gods was made by the Ooocca like Twilight princess's Temple of time.
• The stone used for communication between Tetra, Link and the King of Red Lions is non other then an ancient gossip stone.
• The hero's shield from The wind waker is not the one from Ocarina of Time but possibly the one from The Minish Cap.

Four Swords Adventures

• The Dark Mirror is the same type of mirror as the mirror of twilight but not the same one.
• The Dark World of Four Swords Adventures is created by the Trident and/or the Dark mirror.
• The darkness in the woods of Four Swords Sdventures is the twilight curtain as experienced by regular people.
• Shadow Links are Twili brought forth by the Dark Mirror, and corrupted by Ganon's evil power, manifested physically into a representation of evil: the opposite of Link.
• Ganon's "secondary" title of "Majuu", which means "Demon Beast", is the same as that of Ganon in Twilight Princess, because both of them are exposed to Twilight.
• Ganondorf may be a physical reincarnation of the ancient Gerudo King, but he may also just be an ordinary male Gerudo, with Ganondorf being a traditional Gerudo name.
• The Gerudo are nomads.

Minish Cap

• Link's obtaining of the hat is symbolic.
• The "Triumph Forks" book is not a cameo. It is a valid timeline indicator.
• The books entitled with the Japanese names of the Oracle games are not a cameo. They are valid timeline indicators.
• The book entitled "History of Hyrule" is not a cameo, and very well may be the story being referenced in the SNES A Link to the Past manual.
• Din, Nayru, and Farore are not cameos, but direct descendants of those with the same names in the Oracle games, and therefore, valid timeline indicators.
• Vaati does not die at the end of the game. His essence lives on.
• Veil falls is not the second peak of death mountain but the crater lake in Four Swords Adventures.
• Mount Crenel has two peaks and hense is death mountain in it's entirety

Twilight Princess

• Geography differences from Ocarina of Time can be explained by the zoras simply moving north.
• The Temple of Time is the same one from Ocarina of Time. It's in the forest due to retcon.
• Ganondorf and Zant became soulbound to each other.
• Zants refusal to be revived led to Ganondorf's demise.
• Ganon is not alive in spirit as he was not exposed to the Triforce of Power.
• The Triforce of Power is still inside Ganondorf at the end of the game.
• The Hero's shade is Link from Ocarina of Time.
• The Kokiri turned into the monkeys.

Phantom Hourglass

• The Realm of the Ocean King is an extension of the Great Sea.
• The six sages that have graves in Phantom Hourglass are not the Sages from Ocarina of Time, but sages of the Cobble Kingdom.
• The fact that Link and Zelda were only gone for 10 minutes is explained by the fact that Link retains the [now empty] Phantom Hourglass: They were returned to their time by the power of the Ocean King and the Phantom Hourglass.
• The islands of Phantom Hourglass, were part of Hyrule in The Adventure of Link.
• Zunari the merchant from The wind waker is an Anouki.

Spirit tracks

• Force is everywhere, everything and is not a timeline indicator.
• The land ST takes place in was once connected to Old Hyrule.
• The spirits are the same as the light spirits from TP.
• The dark world is not the Sacred Realm.
• The "power of the spirits" is the Light force from The Minish Cap.
• The land Spirit Tracks takes place in used to have some connection with Old Hyrule.

Zelda Wii (This game has not been released yet)

Back-stories

The Adventure of Link Backstory

• The Adventure of Link manual is still canon, as the newest release of it is the exact same [in the Japanese text] as the very first release.
• "When Hyrule was one country" refers to the days of Ocarina of Time.
• The King did not have the Triforce directly but instead possessed it in the Sacred Realm.
• Zelda's title of "first generation/founder" refers to her as being the first Zelda in the royal fmaily.
• The secret that the Princess knew was the light force.
• The writer of the scroll is the King.
• This event happens before Ocarina of Time.

The A Link to the Past Manual

• The Nintendo of America SNES manual for A Link to the Past is not canon, as it is overwhelmingly full of mistranslations and censorships.
• The Japanese SNES manual for A Link to the Past is canon, as it is the story off of which Ocarina of Time was based.
• The seal war takes place before the events of A Link to the Past, and is not shown in any game.
• The fact that Four Swords Adventures was made to be the Seal war before development was scrapped, shows that the devs don't care about Ocarina of time being the Seal war anymore.

The Fierce war

• The Feirce war was one of the prolonged wars mentioned in Twilight princess.
• These events predate Ocarina of Time.
• This is when [as stated earlier] the Gossip Stones were used by the Sheikah to spy on various peoples and races.
• The Shadow Temple and the bottom of the well show that the Sheikah had ways of dealing with any who were not loyal to the Royal Family.
• The Zora bore a longtime relation to the Hylians and hense were allies when the war broke out.
• The Sheikah bore a longtime relationship to the Hylains (as shown by the bottom of the well) and hense were allies when the war broke out.
• The unifying of Hyrule by the King prior to Ocarina of Time marks the end of these wars.
• All of the major tribes except the Gerudo formed an alliance at this time.

The Minish Cap Manual/Backstory

• The Minish Cap backstory predates Ocarina of Time.
• The Hero of Men is Switchblade I.
• The Picori Blade is not the Master Sword or any other previously seen sword.
• The Light Force is not a piece of the Triforce.
• The light force is one giant ass force gem.
• The Light force is the legendary power that Zelda possesses through all the Zelda games.

The Seal/Imprisoning War

• The Seal War cannot happen at a time after the Triforce has been taken from the Sacred Realm (unless Sound and Drama is Canon).
• The Seal War is the first time evil flowed from the Sacred Realm.
• Though Four Swords Adventures, and the events which inevitably follow it,may set the stage for A Link to the Past, it is probably in no way part of, or related closely to, the Seal War.
• Ganon broke out of the four sword, and stashed the peices of it in the Sacred Realm before A Link to the Past happens.
• As indicated by the Swamp Maiden, some time in between Four Swords Adventures and A Link to the Past, Ganon entered the Sacred Realm and could not find a way back out.

The prolounged wars

• The "interlopers" in this war were composed of shadows themselves, the sheikah and other races of Hyrule. Not all of each race was in the war.
• The bloodshed amongst the people spoken about in A Link to the Past and Twilight Princess are the same set of events.
• The Feirce war was one of the prolonged wars mentioned in Twilight princess.
• These wars were not all in concussion to one another.

Objects and ideas

The Trident

• The Trident was created by Twinrova as shown in arbiters grounds.
• Ganon was never soulbound to the Trident.
• Once it harbors the dark power power, the Trident has the power to turn anyone who wields it into The King of Darkness.
• Four Swords Adventures Ganondorf takes the Trident, takes on the dark power, and becomes The King of Darkness.
• Ganon is only a Yami no maou when holding the Trident with the powers of darkness inside of it.

Ganon's "essence"

• Even after being killed or destroyed in some way, Ganon's essence will survive and eventually reform. Proof in quote:"On Death Mountain I felt... I felt Ganon's presence.

I know the Evil King Ganon was sealed by Link, the Hero. His body was sealed, but his malicious essence could not be sealed. It was through this evil energy's doing that the youth was pulled into our world."

• The essence is the same as the "power" told of in the adventure of Link backstory.
• When Ganondorf dies, Ganon survives untill he is killed. Afterwords he will need to be revived.

Note: Killed and sealed are used interchangeably in the Zelda universe.

Ganon's Title

• Ganon's different titles in the games have significance.
• Any game featuring Daimaou Ganon must take place during a time when the Sacred Realm, or some other specifically named territory, has become Ganon's "Makai", or "Demon World" [Dark World in the English].
• The earlier use of "Jaaki no ou" in A Link to the Past is now "Yami no maou" so the former title should be discounted entirely.
• Ganon is only a Yami no maou when holding the Trident with the powers of darkness inside of it.
• While Yami no maou, Ganon is still a Daimaou.
• Twinrova is only the surrogate mother to Daimoau Ganondorf , the one from Ocarina of Time, The Wind Waker and Twilight Princess. She is not related to Yami no maou Ganondorf from Four Swords Adventures or A Link to the Past (and possibly the original legend of Zelda)

Force

• There is no real difference in "life force, "force gems", and "the Light Force", as all are the exact same word in Japanese. They are only in different forms, and thus, given different names in the English version.
• Life force is similar to a soul, and everyone has it.
• Force gems are crystalized life force.
• The Light Force is a powerful concentration of life force.
• As the "essence of the gods", the Triforce is very similar to three powerful force gems.
• Though the Triforce and the Light Force are not the same item, they are likely made of the same substance.
• Tears of Light from Twilight Princess are/function the same as force gems from Four Swords Adventures.
• Force is everything in the Zelda universe, from the essences you get in the oracle games, to the spiritual stones.

The Triforce

• When walking up to the Triforce, you will get a wish is your heart is balanced.
• If you try to make a wish on the Triforce when your heart is not balanced, the Triforce will split into three peices, and you will get the one which represents you most.
• The triforce will only ever grant one wish for a person.
• You will not get a wish on the triforce before it splits up, only after.
• The Triforce is the essence of the godesses.
• The Triforce itself can not speak, but the godesses can speak through it.
• The Triforce will only split once on each timeline. This is due to the prophecy of the Sheikah. On both timelines, the prophecy has been fulfilled.

Geography (Coming soon)

The dark world

• The Sacred realm has always been a seperate dimension from Hyrule.
• The Sacred realm becomes covered in darkness in Ocarina of time, but does not Transform the Sacred realm entirely.
• In The Wind Waker the Darkness shrowding the Sacred realm vanishes with Ganondorf's last breath.
• Prior to A Link to the past, Ganon gets his hands on the entire Triforce and transformes the entire Sacred realm into a Mirror image of Hyrule.
• At the end of A Link to the Past, the Sacred realm is restored to it's glory not through Ganon's death but by the wish of the Triforce..

Makis

• OoT- The Dark world
• TP- The Twilight realm
• TWW- The dark world
• LoZ- The underworld
• Aol- The underworld
• OoX- The Twilight realm
• FSA- The Twilight curtain and the moongate world.
• ALttP- The dark world
• AST- What's left of The Dark World

Spinoffs

Sound and Drama

• The events of Sound and Drama if Canon replace the seal war as A Link to the past's back story. If one is taken as Canon the other can not be.

Ancient stone tablets

• Ancient stone tablets is Canon.
• The collecting of the ancient stone tablets is to gain the silver arrows so you can kill Ganon.
• Ganon in Ancient Stone Tablets is the "essence" of Ganon.
• The Dark world in Ancient stone tablets is what is left of the Dark World after A Link to the Past.

BS Legend of Zelda

• BS: Legend of Zelda is Canon however it has no over all relevence on the timeline as it takes place in an alternate reality.
• BS: Legend of Zelda shows us that Ganon was meant to wield a trident in the original Legend of Zelda.

Tetra's Trackers

• Tetra's Trackers is Canon.
• Tetra's Trackers occurs after The Wind waker but before Phantom hourglass.
• The pirates play the games on land they occasionally find throughout the ocean.

Freshly Picked: Tingle's Rosy Rupeeland

• Freshly Picked: Tingle's Rosy Rupeeland is canon as it explains the origins of Tingle and has timeline implications. [see Timeline for further explanation]
• Freshly Picked: Tingle's Rosy Rupeeland, featuring a Hyrule made up of several "continents", indicates Deku Tree's success.
• Freshly Picked: Tingle's Rosy Rupeeland's inclusion of places with familiar names [Lon Lon Meadows, Mountain of Death] shows that areas previously only in a "dry" Hyrule can exist post-flood such as the "mountain of death/mount desma" and "Lon lon meadows"
• The Salona are subrosians.
• Lyphos was the ancient hero talked about during the coarse of the game.
• The pirates are the same ones from the oracle games.

Link's Crossbow Training

• Link's Crossbow Training is Canon.
• Link's Crossbow Training takes place after Twilight Princess, and after Link becomes a royal knight of Hyrule.
• The purpose of Link's crossbow training is to rid Hyrule of the monsters left alive after Twilight Princess.

Freshly picked: Tingle's Rosy Rupeeland 2 (coming soon)

Timelines and tribulations

Timeline

• Ocarina of Time causes a timeline split, with games coming after both of its endings.These two timelines are called the "Adult Timeline" and the "Child Timeline".
• The time period when Hyrule was "a beautiful land surrounded by forests and mountains" references the age of Ocarina of Time.
• Freshly Picked: Tingle's Rosy Rupeeland, featuring a Hyrule made up of several "continents", indicates Deku Tree's success but that doesn't imply anything.
• Freshly Picked: Tingle's Rosy Rupeeland's inclusion of places with familiar names [Lon Lon Meadows, Mountain of Death] shows that areas previously only in a "dry" Hyrule can exist post-flood.
• Link's Awakening is after A Link to the Past.
• Art design can not affect the Timeline.
• Sheild design is only important to a certain degree. A timeline can not be based off its style, but what is on the shield itself.
• Official art is Canon unless negated by some other source.
• The Minish Cap's Back story takes place before Ocarina of Time.

Pinecove's current timeline.

(TMC-)OoT-TWW/PH-ST(-TMC-FS/FSA-LoZ/AoL) .......\MM-TP(-LoZ/AoL-OoS/OoA-FS/FSA-)ALttP/LA

Misc

• Light Arrows are not the same as Silver Arrows.
• The sliver arrows only destroy Ganon's body.
• The Sages [Ocarina of Time, Twilight Princess], Shrine Maidens [Four Swords Adventures], and Maidens [A Link to the Past], all perform similar duties, but slowly decreased in power over time, in the order previously stated.
• When referring to Sages and other spiritual leaders, the term "descendant" is not necessarily a blood relation, but a successor. This is shown in the Japenese A Link to the past.
• The Godesses can reperesent multiple elements and multiple elements can be represented by the Godesses.
• Time is represented by all three of the golden goddesses.
• The Happy mask salesman is the devil of Hyrule.